D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directors

Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Phil Anderer » Fri Oct 05, 2018 12:51 pm

Freez wrote:Unless you transfer the covenant to somewhere else, like they did from Christie?? Are we so Naive that we don't think that could be done again to a field in Middleton where we have to start again??


But don't the Christie Trust have to agree to that? Who's on the Christie Trust, btw?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Shrimpy » Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:05 pm

Freez wrote:Unless you transfer the covenant to somewhere else, like they did from Christie?? Are we so Naive that we don't think that could be done again to a field in Middleton where we have to start again??

I've wondered about this a few times.

Would it be a profitable venture for someone to build us a "bare bones" basic stadium on a cheap bit of land somewhere (using the precedent set by moving the covenant from Christie to it's current location) and then demolish the Globe to put houses on it?

Under such a scenario the club getting relegated, or even better in their eyes, going bust would be preferable as the ground grading requirements for such a stadium would be far less the lower down the pyramid you go.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby KenH » Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:07 pm

redrobo wrote:The point regarding the Christie Trust land seems to have been forgotten by a growing number of here. There is no way that they would be able to use the land for development and I'm amazed that certain individuals keep persisting with this threat.


No, not forgotten at all. There's land which isn't protected by the trust, i.e. artificial pitches, part of car park, most of the access road around the ground, land at the front, control room/community block, etc. A lot of scope there for development. I.e. artificial pitches are worthless as they don't have access, UNLESS whoever owns the club (and therefore the access road) grants access and then it becomes a very valuable potential building plot, same with the back part of the car park. And like others have said, it would be possible for the "trust" to sell the whole site and move the football pitch again - just like what happened with the move from Christie Park.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby SupermarketShrimp » Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:11 pm

Shrimpy wrote:
Freez wrote:Unless you transfer the covenant to somewhere else, like they did from Christie?? Are we so Naive that we don't think that could be done again to a field in Middleton where we have to start again??

I've wondered about this a few times.

Would it be a profitable venture for someone to build us a "bare bones" basic stadium on a cheap bit of land somewhere (using the precedent set by moving the covenant from Christie to it's current location) and then demolish the Globe to put houses on it?

Under such a scenario the club getting relegated, or even better in their eyes, going bust would be preferable as the ground grading requirements for such a stadium would be far less the lower down the pyramid you go.


It would be a tough sell but it could be done.

There's also the argument that so long as there's a park for the people of Morecambe in the middle of it, that also counts.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Ntini » Fri Oct 05, 2018 1:27 pm

redrobo wrote:The point regarding the Christie Trust land seems to have been forgotten by a growing number of here.
There is no way that they would be able to use the land for development and I'm amazed that certain individuals keep persisting with this threat.

Freez wrote:Unless you transfer the covenant to somewhere else, like they did from Christie?? Are we so Naive that we don't think that could be done again to a field in Middleton where we have to start again??

RR, Is it unrealistic to think that there is land with development potential behind the club which currently can't be accessed because of covenants attached to the football club?

Is it also unrealistic to think that two businessmen could look to purchase that land relatively cheaply (given the administration scenario and lack of access for development) whilst at the same time purchase the business which has the influence to grant that access permission (or circumnavigate the problem)?

RR, perhaps it's fair to say your dismissive attitude towards these genuine concerns is indeed naive?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby mrpotatohead » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:49 pm

we traded down when we moved...westgate..and particularly the part of westgate where the globe is situated..is probably the worst area in town,so where could an even cheaper part of town house a new football ground?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby marky No.1 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:59 pm

Be quite cheap on the road to Sunderland Point
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Andy D » Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:28 pm

KenH wrote:
redrobo wrote:The point regarding the Christie Trust land seems to have been forgotten by a growing number of here. There is no way that they would be able to use the land for development and I'm amazed that certain individuals keep persisting with this threat.


No, not forgotten at all. There's land which isn't protected by the trust, i.e. artificial pitches, part of car park, most of the access road around the ground, land at the front, control room/community block, etc. A lot of scope there for development. I.e. artificial pitches are worthless as they don't have access, UNLESS whoever owns the club (and therefore the access road) grants access and then it becomes a very valuable potential building plot, same with the back part of the car park. And like others have said, it would be possible for the "trust" to sell the whole site and move the football pitch again - just like what happened with the move from Christie Park.

They can get access to that land from behind that housing estate(mini Rylands) I've put up the trust drawings before showing its possible.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Shrimpy » Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:46 pm

mrpotatohead wrote:we traded down when we moved...westgate..and particularly the part of westgate where the globe is situated..is probably the worst area in town,so where could an even cheaper part of town house a new football ground?

What about all the land off the bypass?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Phil Anderer » Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:11 pm

Shrimpy wrote:
mrpotatohead wrote:we traded down when we moved...westgate..and particularly the part of westgate where the globe is situated..is probably the worst area in town,so where could an even cheaper part of town house a new football ground?

What about all the land off the bypass?


People already moan that we're too far out of town - could easily see another 100 or so giving up if we moved that far out purely on that basis.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Posh » Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:59 pm

KenH wrote:
redrobo wrote:The point regarding the Christie Trust land seems to have been forgotten by a growing number of here. There is no way that they would be able to use the land for development and I'm amazed that certain individuals keep persisting with this threat.


No, not forgotten at all. There's land which isn't protected by the trust, i.e. artificial pitches, part of car park, most of the access road around the ground, land at the front, control room/community block, etc. A lot of scope there for development. I.e. artificial pitches are worthless as they don't have access, UNLESS whoever owns the club (and therefore the access road) grants access and then it becomes a very valuable potential building plot, same with the back part of the car park. And like others have said, it would be possible for the "trust" to sell the whole site and move the football pitch again - just like what happened with the move from Christie Park.


Well said. These rural folk can be a bit naive.

We get relegated, have no money and go bust. Mayfair Finance own the ground. “Excuse me Mr Whittingham can we play football?”. “Yeah sure, but you can’t use any of the buildings, stands or other stuff sat on the land because I own them”. Errr...

As for the land being worth more as a football club. Worth more than £750,000?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby redrobo » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:13 pm

*esus so many doom-mongerers..... :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Andy D » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:15 pm

JB Christie and the land he owned what Sainsbury's bought for around a reported 10million.

Then everything(not just the Pitch) that money paid for at the Globe Arena should be owned protected by the JB Christine's Trust surely?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Gnasher » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:31 pm

redrobo wrote:*esus so many doom-mongerers..... :roll: :roll: :roll:

Pick something good out of all this Neil. I can't.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Posh » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:31 pm

Andy D wrote:JB Christie and the land he owned what Sainsbury's bought for around a reported 10million.

Then everything(not just the Pitch) that money paid for at the Globe Arena should be owned protected by the JB Christine's Trust surely?


Nope, just the land. Read the charge against the club by Mayfair Finance.

payment and discharge of the secured liabilities, the borrower with full title guarantee charges to the lender, by way of first legal mortgage, each property specified below:. 1. the leasehold property known as the globe arena, christie way, westgate, morecambe being all the land comprised in the land registry LAN109788. 2. the freehold property known as or being land at the globe arena, christie way, westgate, morecambe, being all the land comprised in the land registry title LAN107232.. Fixed charges. As a continuing security for the payment and discharge of the secured liabilities, the borrower with full title guarantee charges to the lender by way of first fixed charge:. - all properties acquired by the borrower in the future;. - all present and future interests of the borrower not effectively mortgages or charged under the preceding provisions of this clause 3 in, or over, freehold or leasehold property;. - all present and future rights, licences, guarantees, rents, deposits, contracts, covenants, and warranties relating to each property;. - all licences, consents and authorisations(statutory or otherwise) held or required in connection with the borrower's business or the use of any secured asset, and all rights in connection with them;. - all its present and future goodwill;. -All its uncalled capital;. -All the equipment;. -All the intellectual property;. -All the book debts;. -All the investments;. -All the solidarity payment. -All monies from time to time standing to the credit of its accounts with any bank, financial institution or other person (including each designated account), together with all other rights and benefits accruing to or arising in connection with each account (including, but not limited to, entitlements to interest);. -All its rights in respect of each insurance policy, including all claims, the proceeds of all claims and all returns of premium in connection with each insurance policy, to the extent not effectively assigned under clause 3.3;and. - all its rights in respect of each agreements, instruments, and rights relating to the secured assets, to the extent not effectively assigned under clause 3.3.
Contains fixed charge.
Contains floating charge.
Floating charge covers all the property or undertaking of the company.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Andy D » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:41 pm

Not fair, it was JB Christine's land what genorated the Sainsbury's Money :(
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Phoenix Shrimp 2017 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:51 pm

So according to those I would consider the well informed contributors to this topic we are well and truly up shit creek without a paddle. They offer no glimmer of hope of salvation from the shysters from down south and can only predict asset stripping and devastation for the club as we now know it. Is this now the beginning of the end game?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby mrpotatohead » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:08 pm

Can we be clear on something , our new owners are not "shysters from down south" , they are business people introduced by Peter to save us, remember, no one else wanted the club so it was heading towards oblivion anyway, the point that we have a meagre amount of JB's legacy left anyway begs the question , how did this happen???

What safeguards were put in place when MPG got court permission to move to Westgate, who told him that anything bought out of Christies legacy could be sold off, and who never protected the future of the club, The Christie trust, the court as, or the Morecambe FC board of directors at the time?

Who sold MFC down the river?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby KenH » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:13 pm

Andy D wrote:Then everything(not just the Pitch) that money paid for at the Globe Arena should be owned protected by the JB Christine's Trust surely?


No, it's not. Some parcels of land were sold off including the artificial pitch land. For whatever reason(s), not all of the Globe site was put into the protection of the JBC Trust. Whilst JB donated the land, presumably the club paid for the stands, buildings, etc., so it's right that the club got a share of the Sainsbury money - i.e. only the land value of Christie Park needed to be protected, the proportion of the £10m relating to the buildings etc is rightly the club's!
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby redrobo » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:27 pm

Did anybody raise their concerns with the owners at the Fans Forum a few months back? That surely was the opportunity to raise concerns face to face with the new owners rather than continue to use this forum to predict gloom when there is no hard evidence to predict what is going to happen in reality. Everything is pure speculation.

Posh (to his credit) obviously wanted the Trust to take control but that was / is never going to happen unless its membership tops a few thousands at the very least.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Andy D » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:38 pm

KenH wrote:
Andy D wrote:Then everything(not just the Pitch) that money paid for at the Globe Arena should be owned protected by the JB Christine's Trust surely?


No, it's not. Some parcels of land were sold off including the artificial pitch land. For whatever reason(s), not all of the Globe site was put into the protection of the JBC Trust. Whilst JB donated the land, presumably the club paid for the stands, buildings, etc., so it's right that the club got a share of the Sainsbury money - i.e. only the land value of Christie Park needed to be protected, the proportion of the £10m relating to the buildings etc is rightly the club's!

I could understand if the stands were modern stands although you could ask for compensation for the North Stand what was modern, as for the rest of the ground it needed pulling down, it was worthless.

I would argue out of ie. 10 million 3/4 of that should of gone to the Trust with just 1/4 going to MFC as compensation for the North Stand.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby KenH » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:48 pm

Andy D wrote:I would argue out of ie. 10 million 3/4 of that should of gone to the Trust with just 1/4 going to MFC as compensation for the North Stand.


Given the size of the "protected" land, i.e. stadium, main car park, forecourt and main road entry, etc - i.e. the central part of the site, that's not too far away from how it has been apportioned.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Keith » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:41 pm

My [mis]understanding at the time was that the money from the sale was all going to be spent on a new ground that would then be owned by the trust.

As it actually happened, hardly any of the money spent on the new ground, from the Christie Park sale, has ended up in the new trust. Somewhere along the way, a sizeable amount of money appears to have been transferred from J.B.Christie Trust in to private hands.

I would imagine any attempt at further asset stripping the club by suggesting another move would be robustly objected to this time.

Posh wrote:We get relegated, have no money and go bust. Mayfair Finance own the ground. “Excuse me Mr Whittingham can we play football?”. “Yeah sure, but you can’t use any of the buildings, stands or other stuff sat on the land because I own them”. Errr...


Presumably though, in that instance, the Trust could charge rent for the buildings sitting on the land? The owners would then be paying rent for a building that they can't use for anything and a main stand that has minimal use? Not great, but something to cling hope on to.
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby al1 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:58 pm

I recall that a couple of years ago PMG had a meeting with the council,which was deemed to be 'secret' does this have any bearing on the situation?
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Re: D. Brockbank and M. Hinchcliffe have resigned as Directo

Postby Posh » Fri Oct 05, 2018 10:19 pm

redrobo wrote:Posh (to his credit) obviously wanted the Trust to take control but that was / is never going to happen unless its membership tops a few thousands at the very least.


I haven’t actually wanted the Trust to take control and I’ve never suggested it. In my view Morecambe football club is owned by all of us already. Morecambe Football Club Ltd is the legal entity that manages it. When Darlington went bust the football club survived it was just another company that was established to manage it. As a result, I’ve always wanted owners who understand that. Ordinary fans don’t have the money but others do. When someone comes along they either spend the money for their own vast egos (e.g. putting your own name on a stand) or for your business gain. Others realise that like buying a painting and then permanently loaning it to a gallery or giving a large sum to charity you do it for the greater good and not your own. In my view David Brockbank, Mike Hinchcliffe, Rod Taylor, Nigel Adams, Graham Hodgson gave to the football club predominantly for the greater good. I don’t think PMG, these two or Diego did and I wanted and still want change to a more beneficial ownership that the club, fans and town will get behind.

Having said that I f we go tits up and end in the North West Counties then we may as well be fan owned.
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